SPY alternative with cheaper share price?

Discussion in 'Trading' started by kmiklas, Dec 14, 2016.

  1. kmiklas

    kmiklas

    Is there an alternative to the SPY that is cheaper per share?

    My betting strat calls for leveraging up when certain price patterns occur (specifically, reverse movement in a derivative Elliott wave). For example, if the price is moving for me, I'd like to leverage up 200/300/500 shares to 1000 total.

    The problem is the total cost. Today, the SPY stands at about $226 per share, and so to leverage up to 1000 shares would require USD $226,000. I simply don't have that much money in my account.

    I've Googled around, and tried:

    1. Leucadia National (LUK). It doesn't quite move like the SPY.
    2. Investing into MSFT, as it makes up more than 2% of the SPY, and is 2nd only to AAPL in weighted value. Problem is that it is subect to MSFT-specific forces, and can get a little wild and spikey.
    3. The E-spy mini (?). I've seen it mentioned in several books and Web sites, but I haven't figured out how to invest in this.
    4. The Q's (QQQ), but this is a little tech-heavy.
    5. The DJIA diamonds (DIA), but this is almost as expensive.

    Any suggestions?

    Thx Keith :^D
     
  2. FSU

    FSU

    Your best bet is the SPX emini futures. 1 future equals 500 shares of SPY, and will require margin in the neighborhood of $6,000.
     
  3. Robert Morse

    Robert Morse Sponsor

    Near term Weekly options on SPY have very tight spreads. You can buy ITM puts or calls to accomplish your leverage.
     
  4. kmiklas

    kmiklas

    Thanks Robert :)
     
  5. JackRab

    JackRab

    I don't understand why people bother trading SPY when the far better/more-liquid/less-transaction-costs ES (futures on S&P500) is available. ES leads SPY anyway so you're already behind the curve trading SPY....
     
    kmiklas likes this.
  6. gkishot

    gkishot

    SSO, 2x leverage.
     
  7. Robert Morse

    Robert Morse Sponsor

    Most traders/investors don't have a futures account.
     
    Autospreader and JackRab like this.
  8. CyJackX

    CyJackX

    1 ES exposure is 500 shares of SPY. I'm practicing with 1 lot of SPY and intend on moving up to ES, but I don't want to get that much exposure until I'm good and ready?
    When you say that it leads, I assume that that lead is still fast enough that a human can't take advantage of it.
     
  9. Daal

    Daal

    I prefer SPY over ES, why? SPY has a 1 cent spread, whereas ES trades in .25 ticks. Thats equivalent to 2.5 cents of SPY, overtime that extra spread adds up. Intraday 4-1 leverage is plenty. Plus its a lot easier to scale in and out with SPY given that you can buy/sell as little as 1 share. With ES you are stuck with 1 contract sizes
     
  10. JackRab

    JackRab

    Maybe doable for investing/longer term trading, but pointless for daytrading IMO. What are your transaction costs? A roundtrip for 1 SPY would cost me 0.30% in costs alone... so if you are practicing, I hope you're taking into account that you have to at least cross that threshold? In ES costs are way less.

    By leading I mean it's the more liquid market and because liquidity leads an illiquid market, you get better fills etc with ES.

    But I get you would want to practice in a more safe way...
     
    #10     Dec 14, 2016