China May Soon Lead the U.S. in Tech

Discussion in 'Economics' started by 777, Dec 10, 2021.

  1. VicBee

    VicBee

    That's exactly the thinking leading to the US downfall.
     
    #51     Dec 12, 2021
  2. VicBee

    VicBee

    I was careful to emphasize that it's not about being Asian but about hard work and determination, and these North Asian cultures are driven. I also pointed out that I'm not convinced theirs is the best way to live (Korean kid suicides are the highest in the world) but simply stating the facts to understand why their technical development is outpacing ours.
     
    #52     Dec 12, 2021
  3. VicBee

    VicBee

    What do these companies have in common?
    Google, IBM, Microsoft, Twitter, Micron, Nokia, Mastercard, Adobe, and many others

    They're all headed by India born CEOs who graduated with STEM degrees in India before coming to the US where they pursued Management degrees and went on to become leaders.
     
    #53     Dec 12, 2021
  4. If the culture in the US is in fact better at capital allocation, then this is what you'd expect. Indeed, capital allocation is a better skill for growth than tech skills. So as long as the US keeps pulling people in, things will keep going, the population will keep getting dumber, the divide will keep growing and eventually here will Eloi and Morlock.
     
    #54     Dec 12, 2021
    VicBee likes this.
  5. VicBee

    VicBee

    I have several very successful Australian born Chinese friends whose kids I saw growing up and who undoubtedly will become leaders based on their work ethics, family support and relationships. These are all 2nd generation whose parents came from China no better off than any migrants fleeing communist persecution and landing in NZ and AUS.

    But rather than using anecdotal cases, being in Singapore I see how the system works and is not so different from some European educational systems. High school are hierarchical and all middle school kids are tested prior to see who will end up in which school. This same process repeats for college and from college to higher degrees. Family pressure is relentless, school starts at 7:30 am and ends at 1:30 pm. From there, they often go to after school tutoring school (they're everywhere) until 4:30 pm then have about 3 hours of homework daily and repeat.

    Singaporean are not allowed to attend foreigner schools until last year of HS and with special approval, like one of the parent is foreigner or the kid is showing excessive signs of stress and a psychologist suggests a less demanding school regimen. Those foreign schools (American, Australian, German, French, Canadian, Japanese...) are among the highest rated international schools of the various countries but Singapore considers them 2nd rate. The % of Singaporean kids in foreign HS is very low, a couple dozen in schools of 2k students.

    Here's a link to Singapore education:
    https://www.trade.gov/country-commercial-guides/singapore-education

    From the link, and to validate my argument about Asian who cannot make it to their best universities go abroad instead:

    "However, due to the competitive nature of higher education in Singapore, around 23,000 Singapore students travel overseas to further their studies."
     
    #55     Dec 12, 2021
  6. Nine_Ender

    Nine_Ender

    My daughter is Canadian born, Canadian educated and has been fast tracking through IT mgmt for US based firms. She has many peers and colleagues that aren't fitting the mold you are trying to sell. None of them are taking a second seat to some over educated Asian sourced demographic. I could go on about India and IT but out in the real world people are well aware of some of the limitations of this approach. Certainly it never worked out for IBM.
     
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2021
    #56     Dec 12, 2021
  7. VicBee

    VicBee

    I didn't mean to belittle your educational achievements and I'm sorry if I did. The point I was making is if your country or business is pushing to build advanced rockets, quantum computing, help Tesla build its AI, and fill hundreds of leading research in sciences you will need a PhD or 2 to conduct fundamental and applied research.

    This article details China's increasing growth in STEM PhD graduates over the US:

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/michae...a-in-production-of-stem-phds/?sh=f63b90a46067

    More importantly though, about 120,000 US PhD STEM graduates are foreign students, mostly from India and China.

    Again, the point I'm trying to make is that in order to remain competitive, the US must rethink its education system. Attracting foreign students worked for 60 years and is preferred by those who don't want to spend fed dollars on education. But supply and demand in education is showing its limitations. Our population is under educated, particularly in STEM, from the kids early years.

    Every country in the world provides free or near free education to its citizens, except the US which charges nearly $400k for the privilege of reaching the summit of a STEM PhD. We are a shooting ourselves in the foot.

    But the cynicism is that those against free education are those who can afford to send their kids to college and don't want the sudden competition for college entry and later for jobs that a free education would bring.
     
    #57     Dec 12, 2021
  8. Nine_Ender

    Nine_Ender

    My perspective is from Canada and we aren't having a problem developing STEM based talent; keeping it here may be an issue. You might note that the whole PhD thesis just doesn't hold much weight here; it's more about going to the right school for 4 years and early career choices. School is a lot cheaper and more accessible here then the US.
     
    #58     Dec 12, 2021
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  9. JSOP

    JSOP

    This I agree with you. A large middle-class is essential to the health of a nation both to its economic and political stability as well as providing a conductive environment for educational development.
     
    #59     Dec 12, 2021
  10. JSOP

    JSOP

    They all have inherited companies that were founded by innovative leaders that were not machines but dared to think outside of the box and do something different.
     
    #60     Dec 12, 2021