This is an investment I'd like to forget. I sometimes wonder why I still persist in this tough old game. I get my hopes up but eventually I'm always left disappointed. I purchased Wendy Kirkland's F3 Family Financial Freedom trading system for $5,497 dollars on December 12th and 13th of 2016. I signed up for a 12 month subscription, due to expire on 12/13th December 2017. The money back guarantee stated that if a profit wasn't made at the end of the 12 month period, then I would be reimbursed the full amount of the purchase price ($5,497). I promptly applied for a Money block account as soon as my payment of $5,497 dollars went through. Due to the Christmas/New Year period and a delay caused by Money Block needing confirmation for a minor detail on my application form (which caused me to miss Kirkland's first two trades), it wasn't until January 11th, 2017 that my account was finally open, approved and ready to trade. All Trades were autotraded and the reason I applied for a Money Block account was because of Kirkland's salesman recommending this on the phone when I first purchased the product. Ultimately, however, a profit was not made in my account. A total of 19 trades were atuotraded in my account: 10 losses 9 wins Overall result at the end of the 12 month subscription: $66 dollar loss Full results of the 19 trades executed for me in my Money Block account: The last trade, the AMGN, January 19, 2018, 180 call, was manually closed by me on December 14th, 2017, due to being past the 12 month enrollment period, (which expired on December 12/13th, 2017.) It incurred a loss of $155 dollars, and I certainly was not going to risk losing more money when the subscription was already over. Money Block Starting balance at beginning of subscription: $7,942. Ending balance, after 19 trades during Kirkland's enrollment: $7,884. Overall, this was not an investment I would like to remember, but it is my personal trading story, and perhaps someone here may find some value in it. I've learned an important lesson: purchase products that only guarantee refunds if a 100% return of the INVESTMENT fee isn't made (which was $5,497 in my case). I was persuaded by a guarantee that promises a refund if only a profit isn't made, which refers to the account balance. A system that failed to produce a single penny of profit for me over 19 trades is not something I would consider worth buying ever again or recommend to other traders. Last words Even more worryingly, when I requested the company send me a performance sheet during the time I asked for a refund, their result for the DIS SEP 15, 2017, 110 CALL trade claimed I won $393 dollars, which was completely false. My account shows I only won $68 dollars for the DIS SEP 15, 2017, 110 CALL. An invented, wildly inaccurate $325 dollars extra profit had been written in their sheet to portray a result in my account which never existed. Had I not noticed this mistake, my final result would have stood at a profit of $259 dollars instead of a loss of $66 dollars. I was fortunate to get my money back. My advice for any future customer is this: when you request a refund, demand to see the company's performance sheet and show exactly how they calculated the figure for every single one of your trades. Then compare their results to yours. Only your results matter and your bank statements are critical evidence. You must be meticulous and study all figures. You might spot a mistake like I did. Do not ever count on the company to notice or reveal a mistake if one exists. The representative I dealt with when requesting a refund certainly never did (and I had sent her my own trade results for her to see). P.S. (To see for yourself the inaccurate profit of $393 dollars for the DIS Sep 15,2017 110 Call trade that was invented by Kirklands company, I have attached a link below. When I requested a refund, I was told by Kirkland's assistant that I had made $844 dollars, and wasn't eligible for a refund. I requested to see how their figures were calculated and this performance sheet was sent to me. All my trades were highlighted in yellow for me, including the two I missed at the beginning of the enrollment. They wrote my results in red and black. There were two losses not yet included in the performance sheet because it hadn't been updated, which wasn't anyone's fault. These two losses were the PG The AMGN JAN 19, 2018, 180 CALL, which resulted in a loss of $155, and the PG DEC 15, 95 CALL, which resulted in a $430 loss. These two results brought the claimed profit down from $844 to $259. $844- $155 (AMGN loss) = $689 profit. $689 -$430 (PG loss) = $259 profit. But a $259 profit still didn't make me eligible for a refund of the $5,497 dollars I paid. It wasn't until I once again looked at the DIS SEP 15, 110 call trade that I noticed a horrific error. Scroll down to the DIS SEP 15, 2017, 110 call trade and you will see their incorrect figure of $393 dollars for yourself. This was intended to portray my result, even though my account clearly shows I only made $68 dollars for that DIS SEP 15, 110 call trade. I notified the assistant about this frightening mistake and my refund was processed. These are the kind of mistakes that destroy my faith in purchasing anything from that company again.
I find it remarkable that anyone, let alone someone participating in this forum, would pay anything for any "trading system."
Taking a longer term view, I can remember 35+ years ago when I would have been inexperienced enough to be taken advantage of to this degree. Fortunately I was able to pull myself up past that point before I got caught. I was plenty naive (really really naive), but maybe a little less trusting from ... shall we say 'untrustworthy' experiences ... from a number of people that left me with an open, but jaundiced eye. Potentially there are inexperienced lurkers on ET that this post will offer a teachable moment if they take the time to understand what happened here. So I applaud the openess. Since Siu got his money back, I would judge the experience as a relative win overall. Learning happened. My advice to Siu is not to be discouraged and quit learning about wealth building ... and learn to build your own systems. I have a friend that went all in on a Cali REIT deal from a top brokerage in the 80s that burned him badly and he shut down to wealth building. He's in his mid 70s today and has no stash to live on. Work until it's time to get in the box. No options at that age is far worse than a mistake when younger. There is a special place in Hell for brokers that push red herrings ... just over top of those that create them to begin with. The other point that strikes me here is Siu's courage to lay bare, in depth, the mistake he made. That's really pretty rare when you think about it. Especially on a board that has more than a few that speak like trading gods with not even a sniff of proof or hint of help to those learning. I get trading system secrecy, but it's pretty hard to have any respect for the "successful" that pull up the ladder behind them without even a smudge of help to those learning. Most likely, that 'success' is marginal to non-existent in reality. The truly successful people I have known are all sharing and helpful. They get it. As for the bought system, with a quantifiable, proven 'expectancy' of zero, Siu now has a real introduction to calculating that statistical construct... on top of the human nature speed bump. Frankly, the way systems & edges come and go ... and as small as this community is ... I would love to read more 'documented' stories of both winning and losing systems here like Siu's. I think we would all be better for it. T
I think that the OP(original poster) SIU deserves a thumbs up/like for a well written and very useful 1st post. people, click on like at the bottom of his post.
Several famous traders started out by paying for dubious subscription services like this one (Darvas and a few of the Market Wizards I think?), so siu is in good company.